First I want to say that this is in no way a complaint against any specific players, but rather against SpadeClub. I might even just be stupid and they know something that I don't in which case I appologize, but I guess I will find out. But.... Have you guys noticed how many hands played some of these players play. I mean, something isn't right here. For example, at 1:30am, which was about 45 minutes ago, we were an hour and a half into the month of August. MikeShannon already had 2107 hands played and JohnChai had 2104 hands played. This means that they played over 2100 hands of SpadeClub poker in an hour and a half. IMPOSSIBLE!!!! That breaks down to over 23 hands PER MINUTE!!! NO WAY!!! CAN'T HAPPEN!!! Not only that, but the only tournaments that count towards hands played are the money tournaments, and the only one still going is the $20 Daily Cash from midnight. MikeShannon went out 104th, and even if he still were in it, there is NO WAY he played 2107 hands. IT IS IMPOSSIBLE. I think that this is an important issue that needs to be brought up, because hands played, and other stats, go into figuring and determining the SpadeClub Player Of the Year award. If hands played isn't figured right and/or can be manipulated, then what other stats aren't being figured correctly? I sent an email to SC concerning this, and I will let you guys know what they said to me as soon as I get a response. Until then, I would just like to know what all of you think about this. Again, this is in no way an attack on these two or any other players. I play with both of them regularly, and they are great players and seem very nice. I just don't understand how these hands played stats can reach such outrageous levels. It makes me wonder as to the integrity of the site when I see such things. PLEASE, let me know what you guys think!!!!
Hands Played
I never did the math but it has always seemed to me that some people must play 24/7 to amass the hands played they are credited for.
There are things to consider, first of all SC uses Eastern time on the site, and from looking at the time you posted and subtracting the 45 minutes you said had already gone by, that means that you were looking at Central time. So you must add an hour to your calculations. Secondly what we don't know for sure but would be in line with the rest of SC stats, you are not awarded a final table the minute you reach a final table, but one you bust out, so a game that someone started at 11 pm eastern time but he didn't bust out until after midnight ET, then EVERY HAND played that entire tournament would be credited to the next day/month so The person you refered to played in the 500 II at 9 PM and went out 159th, if that was 3 hours after the start every hand he played in that 500 would be credited to the next month. The unknown is at what time does SPadeClub roll over to the next month. It is also possible that someone throws the switch for the next month to begin at 10 pm. I recall seeing the new month begin for SpadeClub at 6 PM on a Sunday one time.
My point is that there are way too many variables for any conclusions to be drawn, and there are alot of possible explainations for the high hand count so soon after midnight.
The one indisputable conclusion that can be drawn is that anyone that plays as many hands as he does in a month, doesn't get out much.
It seems to me that the valid point to be addressed in all of this concerns the possible miscalculation of other stats. Valid point. Valid questioning. It should be discussed among everyone & opinions given to SC. If they are listening & care like they say then it won't be a problem to get an answer. I myself am looking forward to any reply easynow may receive from SC.
And to add in a little more of my 2 cents worth...you always make excuses for anything SC does. Doesn't matter what they say, doesn't matter what they do. You always present a well thought out & well spoken opinion concerning the issue at hand. The bad thing is, you always present it in a way that gives an excuse to SC's actions. How bad do they have to fuck someone over to be held accountable for anything in your eyes? They aren't perfect. Accept it. It's not the end of the world if you view them that way either. I expect you'll get a little fired up by everything I just said. If so, sorry is all I can say at this point.
Actually I thought I was taking up for MikeShannon not SpadeClub. I simply present possible explainations for a high hand count early in the month, and would be willing to bet that I am right about the entire tourney starting at 9 and busting out at 12:01 counting for a large hand count at 12:01
Wow! Now thats the kind of response I was looking for!!!! Exactly! I mean, Doc, I really appreciate your response, and you are right, there may be some vartiables as to which I am was not aware of. But regardless, there is NO WAY that someone can play that many hands that quickly. And actually, I am on Eastern Time, so if SC is as well, then my calculations WERE correct. Either way, I don't even think it is possible to get in 2000 hands in 12 hours on SC, much less in 2. Thanks a lot Cardjunkie!!! You just made me glad I posted this!!
But either way, lets just take a minute and look at this objectively. You seem to be an intelligent and educated individual Doc. Lets figure the math, lets say that an average hand on SC takes 1.5 minutes to complete, which is probably close to accurate if not shorter that the actual average is. That means there are 40 hands per hour. Lets further assume that the average money tournament takes 5 hours to complete from start to finish. I count 10 money tournaments a day, so thats 50 hours, assuming you were to win every one. 50 times 40 is 2000. So, one would have to at least make the final table in EVERY money tournament to get in 2000 hands in one day. Am I figuring correctly?
And just to clarify again, I was in NO WAY implying that MikeShannon or anyone else was guilty of any wrongdoing. As far as I am concerned Mike and everyone else for that matter, is just playing the game, and has no control over how SC does their calculations. But, I am sure that everyone would like to know that these calcualtions are performed properly and correctly. I know I wouldn't want to be on a leaderboard knowing that the calculations were performed incorrectly. I want to earn what I win fair and square, as I am sure we all do.
Just watched 4 hands, 92 seconds, 37 seconds, 47 seconds, and 42 seconds.
A live action dealer can get out 30 hands an hour, the internet is at least twice that.
Here is what I found on the internet.
"most well trained poker dealers, average 35+ hands per hour"
Please please, do not mistake my presenting a possible explaintion as taking sides against your opinion, I simply present a view from a different angle and tend to think outside the box.
Well I can tell you that SpadeClub is off on some calculations and I don't know why. The Final table leaderboard is always lagging behind the actualy count.
Ok, but I really don't think that the average would be that high on SC. I'll give you 60 just for the sake of arguement. 60 times 50 is 3000.
Here again, assuming you were in at least 5 hours of every tournament. Is is possible, yes. Is it likely, heck no. Also, I looked at the first place finishes for the month of August. They have credited 4 people with a first place finish for August. Which means that the last 4 tournaments from yesterday were figured into the standings. 4, I say again, FOUR. That means that they had to get 2100 hands out of 4 tournaments. Is that possible, maybe. If you won all 4 tournaments, the hand count MIGHT be that high, but I seriously doubt it. And btw, neither of them even made a final table. So, something is definitely going on here.
Excellent. So about 55 seconds per hands. And this is a very small sampling bias, so it is probably not accurate, but it gives us something to go on just for the sake of arguement. So basically, about one hand per minute, which figures to 60 hands per hour. This is the amount I gave CardJunkie in my post below, so see those calculations. And just to let you know, I appreciate you giving your perspective from an "outside of the box" stance. The first thing you should always do when trying to prove any theory, is to try and disprove it. I enjoy and welcome your view, as I always try to look at things from ALL perspectives, regardless of how I may feel about the situation. Thank you as well Cardjunkie, for all your thoughts on this.
I noticed last night at midnight the leader boards went to all zeros. The $20 tournament started at midnight. I was dealt 5 or 6 hands and then I was moved tables, the leaderboard on the new table showed that I had played 780 hands. How is that possible, it was only 10 minutes after midnight, we werent even dealt 20 hands yet. I wasnt in any other tournaments. The $50 ended at 11:37, so I didnt play for 20 minutes until the $20 started. So how can that be that I had 780 hands played for the month of August at 12:10 am on the 1st of August. Somethings not right.
LOL. Timothy Leary! I knew there was something I liked about you LQQIN! LOL.
ME:
THEM:
Hello, Thank you for contacting SpadeClub Support. We are aware of this situation and we are working on a solution. This will be fixed shortly. If you have any further questions, please let us know Andrew SpadeClub Support
MY REPLY:
Hmmm...ok, it will be "fixed shortly". So is this an acknowledgement of something broken or of a player manipulating the stats somehow? I'm well aware that you aren't going to answer me truthfully if a player is manipulating the system but it would be nice for some kind of explanation as opposed to the standard reply.
I was at a table with MIKESHANNON in the 8pm $50 last night for an hour and a half and he sat out a large percentage of time! I know as sure as I am sitting here there were over 30 hands played so why was he able to stay so long. After the 1.5 hour of sitting out he played for about 15 mins. I believe this is how he has so many hands played. I think it is BS to sign up for a game and not play. So you have 8 billion hands who cares???
I wish everyone would sign up for a game and not play.
dr,
If you are serious, let me know which game you want to enter and I will join in.
OK well my preference would be the 40 K on Sunday........ Maybe I could reach the final table that way.
